Hi Meliza

This is a different situation to that described by Justin.

INWW (a division of Melbourne IT) interprets the policy as if the business
name is a legal entity in its own right (which it is not).

They look at it as if the Business Name owned the domain name.  As most (not
all) domain names are supported by a business name it is a simple matter to
go along to the Dept of Fair Trading in your State and transfer ownership of
the business name.

The associated domain name then becomes yours without INWW being involved
except for changing the contact details.  Thus the domain name is
continuously registered and there is no need for a "terminate and re-apply".
Zero risk.

Justin is saying that where a terminate and re-apply IS performed there's a
risk during the short time between the terminate and the re-apply.  This can
be avoided if the old owner "Fred Smith" transfers the business name to the
new company  "Fred Smith Antiques Pty Ltd" in the way I've described above.

The problem with that is that the new company has to keep the business name
for ever paying a renewal fee every three years.  Just to safeguard its
domain name.

Regards
Patrick Corliss


-- Original Message -----
From: Meliza Smith <smithm&#167;callawrie.com.au>
To: <dns&#167;auda.org.au>
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2000 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: [DNS] Selling com.au names [was: Re: AuDomains.com]


> I recently came across the situation where the state business name under
> which the .com.au domain name was registered was sold to another company -
> all that was required was documentation be submitted to INA supporting
> change of ownership of the business name.
>
> Is this 'zero risk'? It is still done manually by INA. I don't know how
long
> it takes for the change to be recorded but will let the group know once I
> do.
>
> Meliza Smith
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Justin Sullivan" <js&#167;justnet.com.au>
> To: <dns&#167;auda.org.au>
> Sent: Sunday, 1 October 2000 9:17 AM
> Subject: [DNS] Selling com.au names [was: Re: AuDomains.com]
>
>
> > At 02:55 1/10/00 +1000, you wrote:
> > >anthony white wrote:
> > >
> > > > check out www.audomains.com for the latest.
> > >
> > >You'll notice they're trying to sell .com.au names contrary to the
> policy.
> > >There's a big risk in doing that, I would have thought.
> > >
> > >Regards
> > >Patrick Corliss
> >
> > Actually INA has a way of allowing "selling" which is presumably
official
> > enough as they have formal documents and application forms to support
it.
> > This is the "terminate and re-apply" process. Essentially, company A
that
> > currently holds the name asks them to cancel the license, and in the
same
> > breath company B applies for the same name. Obviously company B must
meet
> > all the usual com.au allocation/application terms such as having a
> suitable
> > business or company name.
> >
> > This is only processed offline (paper based forms) and is done manually,
> > presumably to ensure both things happen at the same moment.
> >
> > The only bad news is there is still a disclaimer on the top of the first
> > page that essentially says they don't guarantee someone else won't snap
up
> > the name midway through the process :-( Not good news when our clients
> have
> > just agreed to pay a third party a sizable sum for a particular name and
> > then have to agree that they may be throwing it all down the drain.
> >
> > And for those completely opposed to selling names at all, consider also
> the
> > case of (fictional) character "Fred Smith Antiques" who is a sole trader
> > with a small business and the name "fredsmithantiques.com.au". He has
> built
> > up a thriving online presence over the years and incorporates and
becomes
> > "Fred Smith Antiques Pty Ltd" and on his accountants advise he cancels
the
> > business name registration, maintaining just the company. But as the
> domain
> > name is licensed to the business name, technically the domain can now be
> > revoked as the business name (license holder) doesn't exist any more. So
> he
> > really needs to sell the name to the new company entity in order to keep
> > using it - even though essentially there is no change in use in most
> senses
> > of the word.
> >
> > I believe there needs to be a zero risk option for people in this
position
> > to ensure they keep their established names and do not have to face any
> > risk of losing them. The difficulty with picking out this particular
case
> > is that there's no way for the registrar to conclusively tell whether
it's
> > essentially a change in the legal structure of the business like this,
or
> > an actual sale to an unrelated party. Ensure the "old" owner is a
> > shareholder or director of the new company? I'm sure that would be
worked
> > around in the same way as some of the current policies are worked
around -
> > "we'll buy your domain name from you and here's your token 1 share out
of
> > the 10,000,000 on issue so that the registrar sees this as a related
party
> > transaction not a third party, and we make sure we get the rights to the
> > name we're paying for..."
> >
> > Maybe the current "terminate and re-apply" process actually is zero
risk,
> > but it certainly doesn't read that way from the disclaimer. But maybe
> > that's INA covering themselves just in case... If anyone (especially
> > someone from INA) can shed some further facts on the process I'd
> appreciate
> > it. Whatever one thinks of selling of com.au names generally, I think
> > everyone should agree that people like the "fredsmithantiques.com.au"
> > example should have a way to go through the above scenario in complete
> > confidence.
> >
> > Regards,
> > JS
> >
> > --
> > This article is not to be reproduced or quoted beyond this forum without
> > express permission of the author.  You don't know who really wrote it.
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>
> --
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